Using Hypnosis for Spiritual Awakenings | John Moyer

Hypnosis

Will: [00:00:00] Everyone wants to unlock the mysteries of the mind in order to improve ourselves? Don't we absolutely. So we all kind of throw ourselves into hours and hours and hours of self-reflection meditation, breath, work, 

drugs, whatever you're into. We talked about that 

over the last year, over the show, but what if there was a way to tap into your absolute potential without having to spend years and years and years, and years and years in quiet, contemplation.

Well, that would be fantastic. Right? Our next guest knows exactly how to do that. And you're going to share that secret with us. This 

John Moyer: is when you don't want to miss, 

[00:01:00] 

Will: welcome to the skeptic metaphysicians I'm will. And today we have the absolute pleasure to introduce to you a gentleman by the name of John Moyer.

John has discovered the power and ability of the mind and shares his knowledge to his 230. Thousand subscribers on. And we're about to find out what that secret is. John, welcome 

John Moyer: to the show. Thank you for having, and I have to say it's it's you guys have such a nice kind of contrast. There you look, tan and well rested.

And here I am. I've got the afternoon sun making me look very, pale, but maybe it's a good metaphor for. The contrast and whatever we might discuss today. Well, 

Will: you might've found the power of the mind, but we found the power of the lighting. 

Karen: Very true. 

Will: Now, before we learn what the secret to accessing the power of our minds is Jonathan.

Where you were before you found out, and what brought you to the realization that you had actually found it? 

John Moyer: [00:02:00] My experience was I had been doing stand up comedy professionally for 20 plus years. And, you know, I graduated from theater and film school and along the way, I had some independent screenplays produced.

And the thing is, is being onstage that live experience interaction with an audience really, you know, was, was my passion. That, and the thing was, is when you, when you study screenwriting, when you learn about screenwriting, the notion is, is that all. Drama is conflict, right? So you're not going to have home alone if the kid's not left home alone and there's not burglars trying to break in the house.

So I kind of applied that template to my stand-up comedy, where it was the more dysfunctional and the more drama and conflict that I had in my personal life. You know, the, the more jokes I could make about it and be funny on stage, but the thing. I experienced was that while I was able to make people laugh on stage, my personal life was a train wreck.

And I was probably in one of the darkest [00:03:00] holes that I had ever experienced personally in my life. I want to go through divorce. I was a single father of two young boys dating all the wrong women. And what wound up happening was is that I was performing an event. it was this all day event with different activities.

I performed my standup show and the venue that I was in may be helpful. You know, it was an okay audience. It was a, there was uh, a tepid response, but then right after me, they, and I realized this, they had a stage hypnotist and for, you know, the venue being half-full for me, it was like standing room only to see the stage hypnosis.

And you know, that ego mind of, you know, the, you know, the comedian you're, you're a little resentful, you're a little jealous. And, and especially as I watched his show, you know, the audience was engaged. Volunteers were hypnotized. And then after the fact, people are running up and throwing money to buy CDs for weight loss and stop smoking.

You know what I, I could do that. I was looking for a way to reinvent myself professionally and I [00:04:00] just, of course, had to learn how to hypnotize people, which, which I did. And as I began the stage hypnosis show and I began experiencing, you know, what hypnosis was able to create for an individual. I, I thought, well, you know what?

I can use that to maybe clean up some of my dysfunction and some of my drama and. As I did, then it was like, everything changed. It was like night and day. Professionally, everything took off for me and personally I was in a happy, well adjusted place. 

Will: So I guess it kind of let the cat out of the bag.

Right? The secret is hypnosis, but it goes a lot further than just what you mentioned stage hypnosis. Right? We've all seen the guy who acts like a chicken or the person who says it can't dance, things like that. But you take that. And you go so much further into it than what people have seen on stage as a, at hypnosis show, which you do want.

you use a tool in, in other ways that really helpful in lots of lots of ways. 

John Moyer: Yeah. Well, you know, when you're, when I was [00:05:00] doing the stage hypnosis show or doing the stage hypnosis show, you know, you want to rapport with the audience that, of course you want people to come up and volunteer on stage, right?

So you want to incentivize the audience members to come up and participate. So, you know, one of the things I do as I'm setting. You know, the, the pre-frame for the show is letting people kind of understand what hypnosis is. Dispelling some myths, let them know what to expect, you know, what they can not expect, you know, like the, any negative elements that people might kind of, perceive To be the experience of hypnosis, but I also tell them, look, if you are looking to achieve a goal, if there's something in your life that you want to have, do or be to increase the quality of your life, when you come up on stage, keep that in mind, because what we do tonight will allow you to be empowered.

To achieve your goals. And, you know, I always tell the audience we're never going to discuss that. I don't make a joke out of people's goals, but that remains between them and their subconscious mind. But the experience [00:06:00] of being on stage, they're able to walk away, kind of tuned up and empowered to realize how they can use their mind for the greater good instead of working against.

Karen: So there are so many preconceived notions when it comes to hypnosis. Well, at least for me, what I've never been hypnotized and, you know, you've heard some people say, well, you know, you're really aware of what's going on, but it's a little funky. Other people would say they don't remember anything. What really is the experience of someone being 

John Moyer: hypnotized really unique to every individual person?

Now, interestingly enough, there was a time when I thought. I could never be hypnotized no way not going to happen. And then I experienced it and, and, and you're just like, oh my God, this, this feels amazing. This is really profound feeling and experiencing hypnosis is, you know, it's like working a muscle.

It's like going to the gym, you go into the gym. You're not going to suddenly, you know, lift all these intense amount of heavy weights, but w you know, with practice and continual repetition, you're able to build that [00:07:00] muscle up. It's the same thing with being able to. Build your mind up relative you know, to hypnosis.

So the, but the experience for people is very unique. Some people, when all is said and done, it's kind of like, you know, a dream, you, maybe you don't remember all the details. It's a little blurry and then bits and pieces come back to you. Other people will say I was aware of everything that was happening the entire time.

I just felt so good that man, I was just, you know, I was just flowing with it. So it can be a very you know, there's not a, a black and white cut and dry experience for everybody. She needs the person and I 

Will: promise we're going to get to all the. Of hypnosis in the journey that we are all on in a second, but we kind of have to set the stage a little bit because you hear a lot about hypnosis and there's a lot of misconceptions about it.

One of the things I've heard and I've, known about hypnosis is that they say. Hypnotize anyone you can't make someone do something that they would normally do anyway. Right? So you can't force someone to act like a chicken. If the person is averse [00:08:00] to being 

Karen: seen as a chicken, why is it always a chicken?

That's my question. The chicken 

John Moyer: buddy. It's somewhere. That was his, it must've been as big closing finale that everybody just started ripping off. But yeah, you know, you're you're right. Well, when it comes to the subconscious mind that that part of our, you know, our moral code or our moral compass is so deeply ingrained in us that, you know, I can't, appetize somebody to go Rob a bank, unless of course they're actually a bank robber and, you know, one of in an even.

To a smaller degree that some people make all that sounds such a big deal, but love telling the story about. You know, I have a friend and colleague and he was actually the hypnotist that I had seen performed that I'm like, I want to do this. And then he and I have become really good friends. But he was doing a show one time and, you know, had a group of volunteers and, you know, the ones that really stand out, you kind of refer to them as the stars of the show.

Right. They're the people that do experience hypnosis and. You know, but there and their personality is so [00:09:00] engaging that they really shine on the stage. So here was a guy that was just participating every skid going along, getting big laughs. And then for my buddies, one of his finales, he told this volunteer that he was going to dance like Michael Jackson.

So because when you hear the music, your eyes opened up, you start to dance like Michael Jackson music. He had to play guidance. Didn't open his eyes, nothing happened. Right. And my buddy's like, this is so weird. He was doing everything else after the show. My buddy interacted with a volunteer and the volunteer told him that he was whatever, you know, religious belief or persuasion that they felt that dancing was inappropriate.

Right. You don't do that. So just a small little thing. Dancing, his moral code for him was so strong. Like he's not going to dance in public. 

Will: It's funny. I've got a note to ask you about this later on, but as will bring it up now, there was a point in time when gasp I was a smoker. I know shocker.

I was a smoker and [00:10:00] there was I don't remember exactly when or how the circumstances were, but I ended up going to a group. Presentation that a hip dentist was doing. And he actually got us to go into such a. hypnotic state and I've talked about on the show before, where I've actually felt like I was floating in oblivion in complete bliss.

And it was amazing. So at the end of it, I went up to the guy and said, Hey, I want to quit smoking. Can you help me with that? And he said, Hmm, I don't know. Give me your cigarettes. Like, let's get rid of cigarettes right now. And I hesitated and just that slight hesitation, he said, you know, Yeah. What do you mean?

You're not ready? I want to quit, but, but when I asked you to give me your cigarettes and give it to them right now, you, you weren't ready for that until you are 100% ready to get rid of those cigarettes. There's nothing I can do to, it's going to help you to do that. Is that been your experience?

John Moyer: Yeah, that, that, you know, and that's exactly one of the things that I say to anybody that talks [00:11:00] about utilizing hypnosis for stop smoking because you, that drive to want to quit has got to be stronger than the drive, you know, to, to, you know, to smoke that cigarette. So there's a little bit of internal play there and some internal accountability that deserves to happen, you know, for somebody to be able to make that you know, make that change over.

I w I was doing a show at one point. And I knew that there were people volunteers on the stage that actually were smokers. There was a lot of them hanging out on the patio outside of the venue chain, smoking cigarettes before the show. So there was a woman on stage. I knew she was a smoker and I told her the next time.

You go to smoke a cigarette, it's going to taste like gasoline burning in your mouth. And it was one of those. You give somebody a post hypnotic suggestion at the end of the show. So when the show's over, they're still signing kind of some things that are happening in the audience. So this woman goes outside after the show to smoke a cigarette.

And of course people come out and they're, you know, they're watching her, she lights up a cigarette from her pack [00:12:00] and. Coughing and gagging and spitting. And she's like, what the hell is wrong with my cigarettes? She takes another one out. Same thing. She's coughing, choking, engaged. My cigarettes are jacked up.

She bums a cigarette from somebody else. She has the same experience smoking that cigarette, but she smoked the entire cigarette, coughing, gagging, spitting, and choking the entire time because her, you know, her drive to smoke that cigarette well, outweighed, you know, Experiences that she was having at that time.

Will: Now, does that experience eventually wear off to her or is she forever 

John Moyer: now? No, it it'll. Well, again, you know, that's one of those things, that's when it comes to a post-hypnotic suggestion, something that is, is really kind of, you know, maybe kind of designed to be kind of, you know, more silly and you know, and fun.

Yeah. That's kind of. You know, drifts, drifts off and drifts away. Cause that's kind of more out there within the realm of you know, a person's experience. But I did have a woman one time when I was on the cruise ship. And when you're on the [00:13:00] cruise ship, I would only do two shows in one night, but I was typically on the cruise ship for maybe the entire cruise or several days.

So you continue to see people that were part of, you know, part of the show. I had a woman come up to me. She said, look, I was at your show. This was me and I remembered who she was. Cause she was one of those stars of the show. And she said, I wasn't even going to come up and volunteer. But you told me that you, you, we could empower ourselves with a goal that, you know, we want to achieve.

And she goes, my driving motivation. My goal was, she goes, I'm a chocoholic and chocolate actually controls my life and overrides everything else. So I know that I deserve to. Give up chocolate. She goes, so that's what I had in mind. When I participated in the show she's has been three days. I haven't had any chocolate sense.

She goes, my friends can't believe it because there's literally all, you can eat chocolate everywhere on the ship. And it was, it was kind of an interesting story you know, excited here. Um, I hadn't talked to her, you know, I think it was in three or four years ago when that happened. And [00:14:00] then she reached out to me on Facebook a few months ago when she.

Remember me still, no chocolate the entire time, one experience and I was done. That's incredible. 

Karen: can everyone get hypnotized 

John Moyer: or yeah, it's, it's actually a natural biological process of the human mind. It's brilliant. The way we're designed. So what, you know, what happens is, is, you know, you've got different brainwave states, right?

Your, you know, your brainwaves operate faster than down the slower. So the majority of the time during the day you're in, what's called a beta brainwave state, kind of your conscious waking state. Of course, when you fall asleep, Those brainwaves slowed down from a beta down into an alpha and a feta that's kind of where you toggle back and forth.

It's kind of a dream wide state. And then down into, into deep Delta will hypnosis and meditation are within those alpha and theta brainwave states. So when you experience those brainwave states, you're kind of in you're in a state of hypnosis. So it's like. [00:15:00] Like with my kids. Sometimes I try to talk to my kids when they're staring at their screen.

They're so focused on that they're oblivious, you know, to everything else that's going on around them. That's, you know, that's kind of a form of hypnosis. We go through everyday when you're watching TV or you're reading a book you're so focused and, and grossed on that, that everything else kind of becomes, you know, oblivious to you.

So it is a state that we all experience. And it's just about. Relative to hypnosis learning to intentionally trigger and activate that state. So we can actually kind of control it and use it for good rather than just drifting through it. So 

Karen: would that also be when you're kind of sleeping, but you can hear sounds.

John Moyer: Yeah. It's kind of that same, that same mental process or brainwave process. Okay. 

Will: So then, and we've established the fact that you can't really make any changes inside yourself, unless you truly want to, how does this. correlate with the self-improvement stuff. If I can say to myself, a thousand times, I want to be a less angry man, [00:16:00] and I go through your, your program and I get hypnotized.

You hypnotize, you put a hypnotic suggestion in me that says I'm going to be a happy-go-lucky guy for the rest of my life. If I don't truly want to be. Happy, go lucky guy. Is that going to 

John Moyer: work for me? I think what I would say is yes and no for that, because let me kind of explain how.

The analogy that I use to, you know, to look at hypnosis when it comes to hypnosis, you've got the conscious mind and the subconscious mind. And between those two elements of your mind is, is, is a built in firewall. It's called the critical faculty. I am, I like in the critical faculty to the balance.

Outside of a nightclub, who's in charge of the red velvet rope who determines who gets in and who doesn't get in. So what's happening with hypnosis is you're distracting the critical faculty. You're distracting that part of your mind, the bouncer with a red velvet rope. So when that element of your mind is not paying [00:17:00] attention to looking at away, You can then sneak in suggestions, you know, to your subconscious mind.

And it does go to the fact that, you know, everybody, you know, is, is different. Obviously it's advantageous to somebody. If their mindset is, look, I already understand that this is not working for me. And I. And preferring to choose out of this behavior. That is actually, you know, I mean, that's certainly a really powerful catalyst going in, but at the same time, there's something to be said for, you know, the law of attrition, you know, something keeps getting into the subconscious mind.

It can pick it up and then all of a sudden start adding. You know, upon that. 

Will: So then . What kinds of changes have you seen in someone that could be used with hypnosis?

John Moyer: Well, you know, the thing is, is that our subconscious mind is essentially. You know, it's our operating system, right? It's all of our computer programming. It's a lifetime of information and patterns that have been poured into our [00:18:00] subconscious mind. And the thing is, is that's what our, you know, that's what we look for.

We look for patterns, identify things. And then our subconscious mind gives them meaning. And you know, the reality of it is it's like Joe Dispenza says we live. We're living in the residual outcome of her past thoughts, experiences, and behaviors. So if you get into the subconscious mind and the thing about the subconscious mind too, is keep in mind.

The conscious mind is the mind that makes judgment and reason. You're able to look at things and analyze them and go, okay, this makes sense. Or this doesn't, but the subconscious. Does it make those kinds of judgments? It's not, you know, it doesn't weigh, you know, reality versus non-reality or what makes sense or what doesn't it, the subconscious mind just says, we're going to, this is connected to this.

So if it's a case where a certain set of experiences show up for somebody and their subconscious mind identifies those as. Patterns that mean we're supposed to be [00:19:00] scared or stressed or worried or afraid. That's what we're going to feel right now. That's how we're going to respond right now. So what you do with a, you know, hypnosis you're going in and there you're, you're disconnecting those connections to those patterns.

You're scrambling those patterns. And then what you're doing is taking those patterns and then reconnecting that. To a more empowered, emotional state, a more empowered mental and, you know, even spiritual state. So when somebody goes into a situation that, you know, normally would freak them out or normally intimidate them or, or, you know, make them feel uncomfortable or scared that when they go into that situation, now, when you anchor the new information and the new emotional.

With those patterns, the subconscious mind is going to go, oh man, there's nothing here to really be stressed about where we feel calm. We feel relaxed. In fact, we feel like we can, speak our voice share our opinion and you know, hold our own. 

Karen: So it sounds like it could be so therapeutic could probably even do couples therapy apart from each other to [00:20:00] 

Will: love each other.

So then how does. Tie in with. The, the thought that we are more than just our minds when people talk about souls and past lives. And now Brian K. Weiss, Dr. Weiss, who we've talked about on the show before that actually hypnotized his patients into going much further than he ever expected doing, talking to past lives.

How first is that something that you have experienced with, if so, how does it work? And if not what are your thoughts on 

John Moyer: that kind of thing? Yeah. And you know, I probably, you know, I have have a really, you know, a pretty big open mind and I'm the first person that when. Somebody says, you know, Hey, there was a UFO or there was this experience or this paranormal experience I'm going to go.

I'm the first one to go. Okay. All right. You know, tell me more. And at the same time, you know, I might go, eh, I, the, you know, this and that. I've [00:21:00] had, I've actually had a past life experience. I was, you know, when I went through my certification with the national Guild of hypnotists and part of the coursework, you know, we did some past life experience now.

It was interesting for me because first of all, I grew up in, I grew up in jury. And for whatever reason, I was always fascinated by the mafia. Like when I read the, the book, the godfather, and then the movie, like in this, I was just enthralled by this. Now what I did the past life regression. I actually was taken back to a time period when I was a, you know, a button man as they call it in, you know, a soldier.

In a mafia family in Chicago in the 1930s now. I go, okay. That was interesting. But at the same time I go, was that real? Or was that something that, you know, my mind was just, you know, creating for me. So relative to me, I [00:22:00] don't, you know, I, I go I'm open, but I'm not sure either way yet. There have been really you know, intense, documented experiences of people who experienced hypnosis and man, they're their recall.

You know, factual information. So, you know, I'm open to say, Hey man, that can wow. That can be a real thing. But you know, when you look at it in the bigger perspective, when you're going to talk about. You know, not, you know, spiritually or, you know, the soul or whatnot. I always tell people that, you know, there's when it comes to hypnosis, there's two groups of people.

You've got the Newtonian physics, people who believe, you know, I have to physically interact with something to be able to you know, move it or, you know, make change. If you experience hypno hypnosis from that perspective, then you're going to naturally experience thoughts and behaviors and actions that will allow you to physically interact and change your environment.

The other group of people, I, you know, I call them, you know, the quantum, quantum physics, the, you know, [00:23:00] the law of attraction people. And, you know, for those people, when you come from the mindset of, you know, everything is, is, you know, is, is energy and what we're putting out there resonates with the world around us and then kind of repels and attracts like attracts, like.

I've seen, you know, results. We, you know, with people relative to that. And, and one of the interesting things that I didn't even realize, I just found this out a few months ago, you know, the pineal gland, we all have, you know, the pineal gland within our brain, but it's got calcite crystals within it. And these calcite crystals have.

PCO electric properties akin to the same thing as like a radio broadcast, you know, signal. So it's like, they want, sorry. I just figured out, well, man, there's, there's part of us inside of us that has these broadcast, you know, capabilities. It's like, you know, when you're watching birds and like birds, you're able to just move like and flow in and, you know, in an instant, you [00:24:00] know, the same direction with a flock of birds.

They understand that that's relative to their kind of, you know, their internal broadcast signal and radar signal. And so it's the same thing for us. So whichever camp somebody comes from when they experience hypnosis, they're going to realize. That there's a benefit. And especially when it comes to like law of attraction people thing is, is consciously we process.

If you put it in terms of you know, computer processing consciously, we process about seven to 10 bits of information per second, subconsciously we're processing about 20 million bits of information per second. So there's so much more happening on a subconscious level. So when I talk to these people about, you know, law of attraction, if I think about a million dollars, I'll have a million dollars or whatever the case may be.

And I go. It's not exactly like that, because what happens is consciously, like maybe we go to a book where we read a book, we go to a seminar, we see movies, something that inspires us. We go consciously goes, man, this makes sense. Yes. I'm going to do this [00:25:00] and it'll change my life. And then a few days later, a week later, you're back the same old patterns of behavior.

Again, that's because consciously something makes sense. And you try to focus on somebody consciously, but underneath and those 20 million bits of information per second, the subconscious mind goes, of course it makes sense for everybody else. And not for us, because for us past has proven us, nothing works out for us.

We, you know, we're not successful. We can't do anything. Et cetera and so forth. And that's the operating pattern that you come from on a subconscious level, whether you realize it, you know, or not. So when it comes to the law of attraction people, it's like, you've got to begin to deeply embed this within your subconscious mind.

So, you know, it's like they say, you've got unconscious incompetence when you don't realize how bad you are at something. And it's conscious, conscious, You know, when you read or conscious incompetence, when you go, okay. Now I realize how bad I am at something which then shifts to [00:26:00] conscious competence, where you're like, I have to think about being good at this.

Then that shifts to unconscious competence when you're just naturally operating from that state where you're able to, you know, successfully achieve something or. 

Karen: And you can help people achieve that with hypnosis. 

John Moyer: Yeah. Yeah. It's, you know, it's, it's, it's kind of, well, it's like they say 21 days, you know, to, to, you know, to form a habit, do something consistently over and over again consciously, then the, you know, that can, you know, that'll become ingrained in your subconscious mind.

The nice thing about hypnosis it's, it's kind of that fast track. It's that unlocking that door getting right in and then making those changes in a, you know, on a faster and an even more effective way. 

Will: Right. And for those that haven't listened to our episode about the law of attraction, a brilliant, brilliant, brilliant man, Benji sharers shared with us.

He kind of bridged the gap between the, the Newtonian. Mechanics or nutrient and physics and quantum mechanics in a way that [00:27:00] it made perfect sense in what you're saying, mirrors exactly what he was saying, because you have to go beyond just wishing it into existence, but you have to feel the emotions you have to subconsciously.

You have to know that what you are wanting to make happen is something that's already within you or inside you and hypnosis. I can imagine, like you said, it, it moves. Damn bouncer out the 

John Moyer: way. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, just kind of, kind of a little aside on, you know, your comment that I've come to learn that, you know, instead of saying, you know, I want something or somebody wants a certain one.

You know, there's a lot to be said for the language that your subconscious mind is hearing. So for me, especially when I put out, you know, meditations for a particular theme or hypnosis for a particular theme I, I share with people to stop using the word want and start using the word prefer, because if you say again, let's just use the money analogy.

I want a million dollars. Your subconscious mind says, Hey, we don't have a million. [00:28:00] We're in a place that makes us want a million dollars, but then if you say, you know, I prefer a million dollars, then all of a sudden your subconscious mind picks up, oh, we prefer this to be this way. We prefer this to be this way and starts to operate from a state of, you know, identical and matching the kind of person that prefers.

Something to be a certain way versus the person who is wanting or coming from a space of, of neediness within their subconscious mind, 

Will: 100%. Absolutely. The want is going to keep you wanting, but they say that the universe gives you exactly what it is that you're asking for. And words. Absolutely. Power.

Yeah. Yeah. So you're just going to say, okay, you want to, you want to, you want to want, here you go, keep wanting. So it keeps it just out of reach. It makes perfect sense to me. You mentioned using this sort of thing for meditations, I've always kind of felt that meditations are kind of up there, like a [00:29:00] form of self hypnosis, right.

Or if you have a guided meditation to kind of bringing you into a type of of a, of a hip hypnotic state,

Is there any danger? You hear about meditation tapes coming out of every nook and cranny, should someone be careful about what exactly they let program 

John Moyer: their minds? Well, you know, the F well, first of all, kind of, you know, talk about meditation hypnosis their sister states of mind. Right. So your ex you know, you're going from the beta brainwave state down with the alpha, but you know, the, the theta brainwave state, so mentally and physically you're experiencing, you know, the same thing.

And, you know, I think the traditional form of meditation it's kind of been assigned with the concept of. Sitting quietly, you know, not, or trying not to think thoughts, that sort of thing. But you know, kind of over the years, you know, you're in term guided meditation which is somebody talking you through something, which is kind of the same thing as you know, is, is you know, as hypnosis.

So you hear a lot of these things, especially when it comes to like YouTube, they're all interchangeable. [00:30:00] Guided hypnosis meditation guided, hypnosis sleep at gnosis sleep meditation. But the, you know, to, to answer your question, well, the one thing that I always tell people is that if you're looking to experience this experiments, see, you know, kind of what resonates with you as far as a style, you know, a program, a hypnotist, you know, a theme.

And if that resonates with you, then obviously, you know, you, you know, you're going to know that, but going back to that moral compass, that firewall that we have inside of us you know, we're going to not allow something that would, you know, radically go against, you know, our, our moral code. And you know, when it comes to hypnosis and, you know, in meditation, you can't get stuck.

In that mindset, you can't get stuck in hypnosis. That's one thing, you know that I hear people go, oh my gosh, I'm what happens if I get stuck and never wake up. If you exp go into a hypnotic state and I were to walk away, one of two things will happen. You either fall asleep. Like you're taking a nap or you're, you'll wake up into a conscious state, so you're not going to get stuck.[00:31:00] 

And then of course we've already kind of addressed, you know, you're not going to turn over your control, you know, to, you know, to somebody else. But, but the thing about experiencing hypnosis meditation is there are quantified. Quantifiable results, even, especially immediately, when you get done with something go, man, that made me feel great.

I feel really part of it, but I feel really good. You know, and of course you might hear from somebody, you know, I'll hear from, you know, somebody on YouTube, occasionally it's like, oh, you know, your voice creeped me out. A huge voice did this. That's cool. That was your experience for whatever you've got linked up in your subconscious mind now, you know, to, you know, your prefer to avoid my content.

Will: Right. Well, I'm glad that you said that. Sorry, cam really quick. I'm glad you said, because those are the two things I've heard all the time. A meditation is self-hypnosis and the gut imitations can actually lead you down the wrong path. The fact is to your point, moral compass really doesn't allow you to do that anyway.

And the second part that you said where you can't really, you can't get. In, in a hypnotic state, it is perfectly safe. 

Karen: [00:32:00] I want to know how powerful can hypnosis be. So will, has always wanted to Astro project, but he can't. Is this something that. Kit or with hypnosis, he would be able to tap into that ability.

Will: Oh, good question, 

John Moyer: Karen. Actually it is, that's not an area that I've kind of had experience in, but I know that there have been, you know, obviously a lot of. People that have had this experience, including you know, a very close friend of mine. So yes, you can utilize hypnosis to, you know, experience that state and, and kind of what you were talking a little bit about there, Kim, relative to how powerful hypnosis can be.

And the interesting thing about hypnosis is, I mean, your mind can't tell the difference between what's right. And what's not on a subconscious level consciously, you know, maybe you're watching a movie and it's really scary, or it's really sad. And then all of a sudden you find yourself, you know, you're stressed, you know, if you feel scared or you're upset because you feel sad [00:33:00] because on a subconscious level, your mind is making those connection and telling you what this means.

So you physiologically have. Response as if it were something, you know, that we're real, it's, you know, it's like when you, when you have a dream, no matter how bizarre the dream seems, while you're having that dream, you're like, all right, this just seems completely normal that, you know, whatever bizarre thing it is.

And one of the examples that I use, I had a woman on one of my volunteers on stage one time, she was a medical doctor. And the suggestion that I gave her was that when she opened her eyes, she would experience. The realization that our belly button was missing and she's going to want to find her belly button.

And it was one of these things where I'd given, you know, multiple suggestions to different people throughout the, you know, the volunteers. So when everybody opens their eyes, I'm on one side of the stage doing some stuff with, you know, some of the volunteers, but yet you hear people in the audience they're, they're laughing and they're whispering and they're commenting.

And I act like, I don't [00:34:00] know what's going on, but you know, then I look over and I see this woman, who's a doctor, she's up, she's looking under the chair. She's lifting up. She's touching your stomach. And I go, well, you know, what's going on? And she goes, she goes, my belly buttons missing. And she goes, she's looking around.

And sh and you could see this kind of the struggle within her mind. She goes, I am a medical doctor. This is impossible. This cannot be the case. But yet I've lost my belly button and she's looking around her. So her mind was, you know, overriding and was, she was having the experience that this was real. So now if you put that in the context of somebody looking to try to improve the quality of their life, if you tell your subconscious mind, You know, you love going to the gym, going to the gym feels great, or whatever the case may be, your subconscious mind is going to experience that as real for you.

And then therefore begin to [00:35:00] take that input and communicate it as an output that you act upon you. Hey, I do love going to the gym. I do love working out. This is great. And that's, that's kinda how it works as a catalyst for. All right, 

Will: John, I think you and I are going to have a conversation after this, but I hate going to the gym.

Karen: Can you hypnotize 

John Moyer: yourself? Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and, and the way that, that kind of began for me was I just started listening to like, you know, hypnosis and, you know, meditation, you know, programs and it, it, and it was the same way as like working in the muscle that I built that up and I could experience it to the point now.

When I sit down, you know, like every morning, every night, I'll do, you know, a meditation where I'm sitting in the Lotus position, right. And, and as soon as my body gets into that position um, my subconscious mind immediately goes, oh, this is what this means. This is what this time is for. And this is how we'll experience that.[00:36:00] 

And then just immediately, my mind starts to slow down and go into those states. 

Will: What about those people that. Like Karen has a difficult time stilling her mind enough to meditate if someone hasn't had an ability or hasn't successfully been able to just be still, can they still have benefit from 

John Moyer: What you do. Yeah. Because, well, you know, there, there, couple of things with that, if we've conditioned our minds, especially in this day and age with cell phones and the internet and social media, whatever the. Conditioned our minds to feel like we constantly need some type of stimulation. There's, you know, it's like squirrel, we have to look over here.

We have to look over here or whatever the case may be. So when it comes to somebody that says, Hey, I have a hard time quieting my mind. You start piecemeal, you start with, you know, a shorter, you know, meditation, a shorter experience. And again, you just gradually build that up and you go, well, you know, I can actually.

Find myself [00:37:00] being able to focus for, you know, three or four or five minutes. And then all of a sudden you can find yourself going, you know, longer. And that was that way for me in the beginning, you know, it's like, oh, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, man. This feels like, you know, an eternity, right? And now I have no problem with, you know, meditating for periods from 30, 45 to 60 minutes.

And then actually feeling like that was only just a few minutes, which is actually, that's something that there is a time distortion within your mind when you experience hypnosis, where you don't realize the time, you know, that's passed. So, yeah, but that's, that's exactly how it happened for me. Just a gradual piecemeal building up of the.

Okay. Now, could 

Karen: you use gnosis to fast-track someone to get to that state? Like, could you help them achieve that meditative state? 

Will: Someone's kind of impatient, 

John Moyer: just curious. Well, you know, the thing is, is that yeah. Cause you know, your conditioning, [00:38:00] it's just a matter of conditioning, you know, a person say, Hey, I can, I can experience this for, you know, a couple of minutes and, and then you, you you're, you know, you're doing little things to try to anchor.

You know, within their subconscious mind things from their external environment that also acts as an anchor or a suggestion, you know, for people to be able to go and relax, you know, faster and deeper. It's, it's one of the, you know, the kind of a common thing you might, especially when it comes to stage.

Hypnosis, you'll hear a stage hypnotist say, you know, any sounds that you hear around, you will allow you to focus on my voice. You know, and those sounds will help you relax even deeper. So, you know, you're, you're constantly creating various things that the subconscious mind can link up to, even in the, you know, in the very early stages that will continue to compound and escalate the hypnotics.

Will: So taking it back to Karen's question about self-hypnosis, that's really what you used to [00:39:00] improve your circumstances in life. Going back to the very beginning of the interview you were able to use self-hypnosis to, in order to improve all of the circumstances that you were experiencing.

Yeah. in stage hypnosis, it seems like you hypnotize someone in an instant, right? Where in meditation, you relax and take the mind and after 20 minutes, and finally you finally maybe hit that data way. What, how do, how can you instantly hypnotize someone in.

Whether it's on the stage or in a consultation, you move much faster. There's something you do. Like there's a button you press on someone's psyche or something. 

John Moyer: The thing is as if you're doing something, let's just say one-on-one you're able to customize. You know that experience to the individual, you you've, you would have spent a little bit of time before the session kind of understanding, you know, the individual's perspectives and, you know, even as you are talking to them, you're, you're [00:40:00] kind of evaluating them and you're calibrating them relative to your experience and knowing what approach.

Would be the most ideal. And as you're in that one-on-one session, you know, there's a feedback loop. You're able to see how the individuals responding and experience, and you can guide that accordingly. And when you do a stage hypnosis show, obviously I've got about five to maybe 10 minutes to do that. In, in, you know, induction and in, in.

It is kind of like throwing mud up against a wall and, you know, you're, you're seeing what, you know, what sticks but you also allow yourself having the experience in doing that. You know, what kind of works for the masses in an environment like that, even now, every audience is different. So if you get up in front of a, you know, a group of people, if it's like a corporate event, And you're building rapport.

I realized that I have to take an approach. That's a little different, not just in how I'm presenting myself, but also [00:41:00] how I am conducting, you know, that, that, that group induction versus if I'm in front of a group of high school students or university students, you know, they're used to kind of being told what to do.

So I know when they come up on stage, I can take, you know, a little bit more. Authoritarian, you know, you know, approach and really when it does come to S you know, stage hypnosis, there is, it is kind of a numbers game. You know, you want to attract the right kind of individuals that come up on stage, and then once you have those individuals, you know, you're just, you're moving really quickly, kind of putting it all out there.

Kind of as this, you know, one size fits all approach. 

Will: Well, That John has been hypnotizing us throughout this interview. You know, why, why? Because he talked about a time dilation and it's already time to say goodbye and I don't know how the heck that happened. Final question. What do you say to people that say unequivocally hypnosis is not real.

John Moyer: You know what you're, you're allowed that [00:42:00] experience. You're allowed to believe that experience. I'm not out to, you know, try to prove, you know, know, anybody wrong. The experience though, for me, that has been, and this is why I love doing corporate events, especially in particular because after the show, you know, you have people, I will inevitably always have people come up to me and go, I never believed in hypnosis.

Now, I know this is a hundred percent real because I work next to that person and that person and that person every single day, I know how they work. I know how they operate. I know how their mindset is and what I saw them experience up there. There is absolutely no way that they were faking. And when you're on the cruise ship, Everybody's strangers.

Right. You know, you have 500 people in the audience and you'll have people go on. Well, I don't know that person. So is this real? It's not, but when you do it in a setting where people are working together all the time then they're able to get. Oh, my gosh, this, this is, this is real. And one [00:43:00] really quick example of that is a few years ago, I did an event for it was a county Sheriff's department were doing the, you know, the, it was a holiday party and they were a little bit of a, you know, a rougher group and they were a little bit harder to kind of get volunteers.

But inevitably you always have people pointing, oh, you know, Bob, you go up or Dan, you know, you go up and they had a woman. Her name was Barbara. I don't remember what, but we'll just say Barbara, she was the head of their county jail and they're all like, Barbara, you need to go up, you need to go up. And normally I wouldn't encourage somebody to come up if they weren't feeling it.

Cause it goes back to, you know, preferring, you know, to have the experience, but. Volunteers. We're a little few and far between for that show. So I'm like, come on up Barbara and she, you know, she walks up there and she was a tough woman. She was the head of the county jail. It's like, you could just tell looking at her, you don't mess with her and she's coming up on stage and you know, she's like, oh, this is BS.

[00:44:00] This is ridiculous or not.

Yeah. It's like, my wife is like, is that how they sound? When I read some comments, did they, did they really sound like that when they were angry? But she closes her eyes and an hour later she opens up her eyes and she's like, what the hell just happened? And the audience was going nuts that, you know, after the show there, they're showing her video that they filmed and she goes, I, and it was one of those people that go, I have no idea.

I have no recollection of what just happened over the last hour. And everybody was like, oh my God. We know that woman and there's no way she was faking that. So. 

Will: Wow. Wow. Well, this has been absolutely fantastic. We're going to put all of your information in our show notes. If you haven't checked out John Moyer, you need to go look at his YouTube videos because he's got some.

Founding videos on there. And we'll also put in your social media accounts on there as well as your website. So people [00:45:00] can reach out to you directly just by going to skeptic, metaphysician.com, going to his episode, page and clicking on the link. It's a one-stop shop. It's super easy. So. John, I can't thank you enough for coming on the show and sharing your expertise with us.

John Moyer: Thank you. Will. And Karen, this, I really enjoyed this. You got, it's been great. So thank you so much. Great. And has been, thank you. And, 

Will: Thank you listeners for coming along on this journey of discovery with us. Don't forget that you can find us on Facebook and Instagram under at skeptic metaphysicians as always.

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