The Atheist’s Guide to Proof of the Afterlife

100:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,760WTF just happened. Have you ever found yourself asking yourself that question? Well,200:00:05,760 --> 00:00:10,880today's guest has, in fact, she does that on a regular basis while diving into evidence300:00:10,880 --> 00:00:16,480of the afterlife in psychic mediums as an atheist. If you're one of those questions of400:00:16,480 --> 00:00:21,120validity behind life after death claims being thrown around in our space all the time,500:00:21,120 --> 00:00:25,760then this is the show for you. Because once she started looking into all the evidence as an600:00:25,760 --> 00:00:31,280atheist, mind you, she says that she was blown away. You don't want to miss this one700:00:31,280 --> 00:00:37,280welcome to the skeptic metaphysicians. My name is Will. And I'm Karen. And unlike Molder and800:00:37,280 --> 00:00:41,680Scully. Both want to believe. So we've embarked in a journey of discovery. We've talked to people900:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,840deeply entrenched in the spiritual and metaphysical world. We've thrown ourselves into weird and1000:00:45,840 --> 00:00:50,960wonderful experiences. I even joined a covenant with you. And wait, you joined a covenant?1100:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,920Yep. All in the interest of finding something. Anything.1200:00:53,920 --> 00:00:58,240That will prove that there's something beyond this physical three-dimensional world we all live in.1300:00:58,240 --> 00:01:00,560This is the skeptic metaphysicians.1400:01:00,560 --> 00:01:19,120Today's story is called The Butterfly. A man found a cocoon from a butterfly.1500:01:19,920 --> 00:01:26,560One day a small opening appeared. So he sat and watched the butterfly for several hours as it struggled1600:01:26,560 --> 00:01:32,960to force its body through that little hole. Until suddenly it stopped making any progress and looked1700:01:32,960 --> 00:01:38,640like it was stuck. So the man decided to help the butterfly took a pair of scissors and1800:01:38,640 --> 00:01:45,360sniped off the remaining bit of the cocoon. So the butterfly could then emerge easily. Although we had1900:01:45,360 --> 00:01:51,840a swollen body and small shriveled wings. The man didn't think anything of it and sat there waiting2000:01:51,840 --> 00:01:58,800for the wings to enlarge to support the butterfly. But that never happened. The butterfly spent the2100:01:58,800 --> 00:02:06,720rest of its life unable to fly crawling around with tiny wings in a swollen body. Despite the2200:02:06,720 --> 00:02:12,080kind heart of the man, he didn't understand that the restricting cocoon in the struggle needed by2300:02:12,080 --> 00:02:17,680the butterfly to get itself through the small opening, we're God's way of forcing fluid from the body2400:02:17,680 --> 00:02:23,440of the butterfly into its wings to prepare itself for flying once it was out of the cocoon.2500:02:23,440 --> 00:02:29,760Well the moral of this story fits in so well when it comes to all things spiritual. You see,2600:02:29,760 --> 00:02:36,640our struggles in life develop our strengths. Without struggles, we never grow and never get stronger.2700:02:36,640 --> 00:02:44,240So it's important for us to tackle challenges on our own and be grateful for them because every challenge2800:02:44,240 --> 00:02:48,320prepares us with the ability to handle the results.2900:02:48,320 --> 00:03:00,800Welcome to the skeptic metaphysicians. Liz Anton began examining evidence of an afterlife and3000:03:00,800 --> 00:03:07,280anything paranormal in 2015 following the passing of her father. But what she was still considered herself3100:03:07,280 --> 00:03:11,840skeptical and an atheist, the evidence that she found just blew her away.3200:03:11,840 --> 00:03:17,360She's the author of WTF just happened a science-esceptic exploration of grief, healing and evidence3300:03:17,360 --> 00:03:22,480of an afterlife and the host of the podcast of the same name all about the afterlife.3400:03:22,480 --> 00:03:27,520No rule in that show folks just plain talk with you. No I love. Obviously you've noticed it.3500:03:27,520 --> 00:03:33,360I am without caring today. Sadly she had a family obligation to attend too so it's just me. But I am super3600:03:33,360 --> 00:03:37,600well accompanied by Elizabeth Anton. Elizabeth, thank you so much for coming on the show.3700:03:37,600 --> 00:03:41,120Thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to talk with you today.3800:03:41,120 --> 00:03:46,000Me too because what you're talking about is right up my alley first and foremost. I know that you say3900:03:46,000 --> 00:03:50,880that you are an atheist. Right. So let's set the table by atheists. You mean you don't believe in anything4000:03:50,880 --> 00:03:56,240or can you quantify that for me? Sure. I guess when I say atheist, I think of atheist as believing4100:03:56,240 --> 00:04:04,480and God in religion and I've never seen any evidence of God and I've just I don't think God has anything4200:04:04,480 --> 00:04:11,280to do with an afterlife. I think that you are completely separate and I think the alignment that so many4300:04:11,280 --> 00:04:17,520people have to me I respect it. But from a factual perspective it doesn't make any sense.4400:04:17,520 --> 00:04:21,360I'm really curious to hear how you put the two together because like the space that we're into4500:04:21,360 --> 00:04:28,240spiritual world that we're both in, it's really tied to a lot about the afterlife. But it talks a lot4600:04:28,240 --> 00:04:32,880about God or the universe or energies or whatever it is. So you don't think there's a, if I'm4700:04:32,880 --> 00:04:38,000correct me from wrong, you don't think that there's a white guy in a robe sitting on a throne in heaven.4800:04:38,000 --> 00:04:44,480Right. So I would find that probably the least likely explanation of everything that could happen.4900:04:44,480 --> 00:04:50,160Am I going to say factually? But to me that is I can't think of anything less likely.5000:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,880All right. So then what and I'm sorry we're deviating a little bit. But then what is your thought? Like5100:04:54,880 --> 00:05:05,040how what is God for you if anything? I think I mean I have researched a lot of the studies done5200:05:05,040 --> 00:05:13,280on afterlife survival of consciousness, non-local consciousness and I just don't see how from I think5300:05:13,280 --> 00:05:21,120it's more of a physics-based answer that in some form that we don't know yet, similar probably to5400:05:21,120 --> 00:05:26,400how the cloud works. I deal with something along the lines of the large catering collider,5500:05:26,400 --> 00:05:31,920significantly more advanced. We'll be able to figure out what the substance is. But that our5600:05:31,920 --> 00:05:41,520consciousness is not created by brain, but downloaded by a brain and continues in some form that5700:05:41,520 --> 00:05:49,680is much more advanced than some singular moral consciousness that somewhat resembles a human5800:05:49,680 --> 00:05:55,840that a current religion has, I would say, as questionable morals anyway. And that that created5900:05:55,840 --> 00:06:03,200all this. It just seems just irrelevant to the topic. And there's just a ton of data that our6000:06:03,200 --> 00:06:11,760consciousness is not local and downloaded. And to me that question has nothing to do with, is there one singular6100:06:11,760 --> 00:06:18,480huge consciousness that created it? So it's just... Okay so really I didn't mean to make this into6200:06:18,480 --> 00:06:22,960a conversation about religion or anything like that or the meaning of God. But the question has to be6300:06:22,960 --> 00:06:30,560asked, do you then some people believe that maybe we are all parts of God? I don't want to6400:06:30,560 --> 00:06:37,600hesitate to do that word in your presence. But when we die, when we pass on, we reconnect, we become one6500:06:37,600 --> 00:06:44,000once again. So my question would be first. Two questions. One is that your thought process. And if so,6600:06:44,000 --> 00:06:51,040then what is it that we join up with? Okay so first, no my thought process is not that at all.6700:06:51,040 --> 00:06:56,560It was just... I'd go into originally my original thought that even got me down this path,6800:06:56,560 --> 00:07:02,560obviously aside from grief was at this point I thought consciousness was created by our brain neurons.6900:07:02,560 --> 00:07:08,480And this will lead into answering your question. No worries. So if that happened once to create a7000:07:08,480 --> 00:07:17,040me or to create my dad, why could it not happen again? Not necessarily me again, not related to karma,7100:07:17,040 --> 00:07:23,040but just another set of brain neurons coincidentally creating another human and it would get to be7200:07:23,040 --> 00:07:29,680something I would experience. Not as Liz, but just something somebody else is if you got to have the7300:07:29,680 --> 00:07:35,920experience of being another person. And to me the only other thought I thought was possible at that point7400:07:35,920 --> 00:07:40,080was complete obliteration. So even though I wouldn't have any memories of my life, it was better7500:07:40,080 --> 00:07:48,560than never having an experience of consciousness again. Part two of my thought was, is there any possibility7600:07:48,560 --> 00:07:55,600in any way shape or form that some of the memories have carried over? So I googled that. I found researchers7700:07:55,600 --> 00:08:02,640at the University of Virginia, Dr. Jim Tucker and his mentor who's sent us past away Dr. Ian Stevenson7800:08:02,640 --> 00:08:07,920factually studying cases of kids with past life memories and getting at-care results after matching7900:08:07,920 --> 00:08:12,800up with data. So my whole approach afterwards I found wind bridge with Dr. Julie Byshal,8000:08:12,800 --> 00:08:17,120more researchers at the University of Virginia, such as Dr. Bruce Grayson, who studied near8100:08:17,120 --> 00:08:27,920death experiences and Dr. Echeli and Dr. Emily Teli who also studies medium-shep and significantly8200:08:27,920 --> 00:08:35,200others. So I just came from it not as their regard, but is there any data that shows that in some8300:08:35,200 --> 00:08:45,040way shape or form we can get information, mediums can get information, that's factual and accurate8400:08:45,040 --> 00:08:52,000that they could not know by more meanings such as Google A and Cold Reading and if so, if all of this8500:08:52,000 --> 00:08:58,400is happening from accurate medium readings, cases of kids with past life memories that check out8600:08:58,400 --> 00:09:04,720near-death experiences, this stuff and occurrences and results are absolutely not explicable8700:09:04,720 --> 00:09:10,080if our consciousness is created by brain neurons and when we die that's it. So what answers does8800:09:10,080 --> 00:09:18,720that leave? And there's no answer in the explanation of consciousness created by a brain that could8900:09:18,720 --> 00:09:24,720explain for this. I sincerely hope it survival of consciousness. I think that's the most likely9000:09:24,720 --> 00:09:33,040explanation and where is it we go? I don't know. I wish I knew. Maybe I'll say it's just this place9100:09:33,040 --> 00:09:38,800of complete love. I have personally I don't like the word belief because none of this is based9200:09:38,800 --> 00:09:45,600of belief it's based on actual data and some personal experiences I've had such as getting medium readings9300:09:45,600 --> 00:09:51,120as well as some other weird things, but we'll talk about all those but go ahead.9400:09:51,120 --> 00:09:55,760Yeah, yeah. This is just pure data so I don't like to have belief in anything. I'm sure9500:09:55,760 --> 00:10:00,480I'm human we all have beliefs it's impossible to say I don't carry beliefs but I try not to9600:10:00,480 --> 00:10:05,040and so where do we go? So maybe this is my coming in with a little bit of belief.9700:10:05,040 --> 00:10:11,280Mediums say that when we pass away it's all love and then we come here to learn. I have a hard time believing9800:10:11,280 --> 00:10:17,600that in this other dimension it's all perfect pure love with the conflict we have here. So I'm guessing9900:10:17,600 --> 00:10:23,520they might experience it that way if I could guess and again this isn't data. This is now10000:10:23,520 --> 00:10:30,240I am going a little into the belief realm but my guess is they experience that or people experience10100:10:30,240 --> 00:10:37,600near-death experiences as all love because like you know let's say you've been traveling for a10200:10:37,600 --> 00:10:43,280month that haven't talked to your parents or your spouse and you reach them you'll call them and10300:10:43,280 --> 00:10:48,800you're like oh my god I love you so much you're not arguing over stupid things or irritated at each other10400:10:48,800 --> 00:10:53,440and are you come back from a you know I'm thinking about like the first time you go to college and you10500:10:53,440 --> 00:10:58,560come home and see your parents like that first day and I'm sure there are exceptions but overall10600:10:59,280 --> 00:11:04,320that for a day you just feel so like the warmth and love so near-death experiences is the very first10700:11:04,320 --> 00:11:10,960moment of crossing over. So that's my guess. I can totally see and hear the scientists skeptic10800:11:10,960 --> 00:11:17,920still hiding under your words and yet you're trying to in your mind make things make sense from a10900:11:17,920 --> 00:11:22,320pragmatic point of view and I love that because that's been me the entire time. Up until11000:11:22,320 --> 00:11:27,360well this show has changed some things for me let's just put that way but what I find interesting11100:11:28,000 --> 00:11:35,120is that there's a thought that science there's no way that science can explain some of these things because11200:11:35,120 --> 00:11:42,800our scientific instruments stop just short of being able to measure into this other realm that we11300:11:42,800 --> 00:11:49,120apparently go to once we pass over. So really there's no way to truly know what's out there11400:11:49,120 --> 00:11:55,440without actually experiencing ourselves and yet it seems that a lot of us who are pragmatic and mindset11500:11:55,440 --> 00:12:03,360and scientific and skeptical we tend to try to still wrap it around some form of scientific explanation11600:12:03,360 --> 00:12:10,400for something that may or may not have a scientific basis to talk specifically about your love11700:12:10,400 --> 00:12:15,360comment that makes perfect sense right as you come back from a long trip and also you see your family11800:12:15,360 --> 00:12:19,360for the first time and oh my god you reminded of how much you missed them and how much you love them11900:12:19,360 --> 00:12:23,680and then maybe that passes maybe doesn't most of the time it passes a little bit the intensity is12000:12:23,680 --> 00:12:29,360not as strong but then there's another school of thought that says that we are love that that is our true12100:12:29,360 --> 00:12:34,480nature we are love so when we pass over we're actually becoming who we truly are which is love12200:12:34,480 --> 00:12:40,560at which point then might we experience complete love with abandon well we're out there.12300:12:40,560 --> 00:12:45,920I would think it would get boring I do think in one sense and again this is more getting into12400:12:45,920 --> 00:12:53,440philosophy than evidence I do think we are in essence love in the sense that's when we thrive12500:12:53,440 --> 00:12:59,840but I don't think I mean we just can't say that's all there is to us it seems like too much12600:12:59,840 --> 00:13:07,600wishful thinking because of how there are people who are really cruel people we can't deny that12700:13:07,600 --> 00:13:13,440there's conflict so I just where does that come from I don't think I think we'll just be going12800:13:13,440 --> 00:13:18,800against facts to say there's only love is that the ideal is that maybe what our goal is to12900:13:18,800 --> 00:13:24,960strive towards yes and I mean I hope we just cross over and there's only love but maybe it's like13000:13:24,960 --> 00:13:30,80030 dimensions down the line because otherwise I don't think like a Hitler or I mean I'll leave13100:13:30,800 --> 00:13:38,240politics out of it but I'm gonna be people you know would be here so you know like yeah Hitler serial13200:13:38,240 --> 00:13:43,680killers right right I understand what you're saying and I think we could debate this for a long13300:13:43,680 --> 00:13:50,240time because I love it and I love playing devil's advocate very quickly though I will say that could it13400:13:50,240 --> 00:13:58,720not be that when we are in that other plane we are perfection right we are love we are goodness in13500:13:58,720 --> 00:14:04,960carnit it's the act of coming into the three-dimensional space where we forget our divinity that then we13600:14:04,960 --> 00:14:11,600become human and have the foibles that come along with being human from the get there's a school13700:14:11,600 --> 00:14:18,080as thought that says that we are perfect but when we come here become human that's when our foibles take13800:14:18,080 --> 00:14:25,280over our emotions are greed right there's no doubt especially in this country that greed is a13900:14:25,280 --> 00:14:30,640runaway problem right now and I think greed is the cause of a lot of our challenges and our14000:14:30,640 --> 00:14:36,000our problems and I think that's because of the human condition when we all just want more and more14100:14:36,000 --> 00:14:43,440right that competitive edge we've had since we were keeping right I mean I sincerely hope we just all across14200:14:43,440 --> 00:14:48,560over it it's pure love but I think from what we know with near-death experiences and I think this14300:14:48,560 --> 00:14:53,360would make the most sense is that you go through the life review where you're really accountable14400:14:53,360 --> 00:15:01,920my thought that we and again philosophy not evidence aside from the life for review my thought that it14500:15:01,920 --> 00:15:08,560would just were all just so advanced that come here it's kind of like well why come here maybe this is14600:15:08,560 --> 00:15:15,520the step working towards that but pure love I mean who wouldn't want that to be true I mean I will be14700:15:15,520 --> 00:15:23,520really happy if that's the case my guess is maybe we're much more like much more advanced than14800:15:24,960 --> 00:15:32,560what we are here and it's the next step but I still do think there's some form of progress I mean you14900:15:32,560 --> 00:15:37,840look at it two year old and they have a fight and they're screaming at each other and like someone takes15000:15:37,840 --> 00:15:42,880one two-year-olds toy and they throw like sand in the sandbox in the other space and to them15100:15:42,880 --> 00:15:49,680grown-ups and again I'm sure there's exceptions of really horrible traumatic homes but overall grown-ups15200:15:49,680 --> 00:15:55,920look like they don't have problems because you never see adults act that way but then there's this15300:15:55,920 --> 00:16:01,360whole other slew of problems and when you look back at being too like oh my god I can't believe I was15400:16:01,360 --> 00:16:06,480upset that my friend wanted to play with my teddy bear for two minutes and my parents made me give it15500:16:06,480 --> 00:16:12,080to them for five minutes to learn to share and that was the worst thing that ever happened and you just15600:16:12,080 --> 00:16:16,480have such a perspective but then we have a whole other slew of problems that a two year old15700:16:16,480 --> 00:16:23,040wouldn't necessarily understand and we deal with them in a way a two-year-old wouldn't observe and if I15800:16:23,040 --> 00:16:31,920to guess it's something like that as you progress but I also think if you just are that and you come here15900:16:31,920 --> 00:16:39,680why come here although I yeah I mean I definitely don't think it's like I think eagles more complex16000:16:39,680 --> 00:16:46,880than just evil but I do think there are evil energies probably I don't know but I I've heard16100:16:46,880 --> 00:16:53,200I'm living it's just love and then only just human that makes things something's horrible I think16200:16:53,200 --> 00:16:58,560we have to look at the facts that there is a lot of horrible and a lot of good and both are true and what16300:16:58,560 --> 00:17:05,280is the source we don't we don't know yet but I do think we have an innate drive to move towards16400:17:05,280 --> 00:17:13,520love and good I mean feeling anger and hatred and it's a horrible feeling we don't but this would be16500:17:13,520 --> 00:17:18,080this is such a complicated philosophy it's this is all just kind of playing with ideas I can't say16600:17:18,080 --> 00:17:22,720absolutely in this and that's really what we're doing here right where I love the debate yeah16700:17:22,720 --> 00:17:27,280over dinner over coffee over drink trying to be devils out of kid trying to come look at it in the16800:17:27,280 --> 00:17:31,920philosophical point of view from different perspectives is all great but I do want to talk16900:17:31,920 --> 00:17:40,320specifically about you and how you got into this space because the death of a loved one is always17000:17:40,320 --> 00:17:46,800incredibly traumatic and some people handle it in different ways you ran in the direction of17100:17:46,800 --> 00:17:54,640is their life after death because I assume you wanted to make contact in some way where others might17200:17:54,640 --> 00:18:01,520have just oh well he's gone and moved on the life you dove into it in a very sincere way so I want17300:18:01,520 --> 00:18:07,920to hear about that before we move forward yeah there's two tiers I think to that first just the17400:18:07,920 --> 00:18:17,840innate like shattering grief and just that moment of desperation actually even before I thought17500:18:17,840 --> 00:18:23,280of and found the research of Dr. Jim Tucker my immediate thought was as there a way to turn back time17600:18:24,000 --> 00:18:32,240since I started to find you know reading about time Einstein's theory of time relativity and17700:18:32,240 --> 00:18:39,120so much of science fiction has ended up coming true is there some scientific way to turn back time17800:18:39,120 --> 00:18:46,000one day and like five thousand years someone will know to go back and get my dad at this17900:18:46,000 --> 00:18:52,000day when medicine is significantly better and so that was just the very first thought I didn't18000:18:52,000 --> 00:18:58,720necessarily think it was practical but it was sort of the only place I knew to go to and so from there I was18100:18:58,720 --> 00:19:05,920so fast say by what I discovered about the relativity of time and just our universe is a significantly18200:19:05,920 --> 00:19:12,640different than we perceive and then finding the research of Dr. Jim Tucker and it became a combination18300:19:12,640 --> 00:19:20,880of this desperation to see my dad again and not just think he was obliterated facing my own mortality18400:19:20,880 --> 00:19:28,480and other ones mortality and just this mind-blown fascination like if you have never ever thought something18500:19:28,480 --> 00:19:32,880like an after life as possible aside from my guess why it was very little like my parents told me18600:19:32,880 --> 00:19:37,920something like cute story of habit and I was like you can think of that like Santa Claus and18700:19:37,920 --> 00:19:45,120the Easter Bunny pretty much you know that was obviously we tell the child about death and just it was18800:19:45,120 --> 00:19:53,280both if this was to be true this was the most remarkable thing I could imagine in terms of happiness I18900:19:53,280 --> 00:20:01,360just it would be unfathomable and it just some existential dread would change and scientifically just19000:20:01,360 --> 00:20:06,880the most fascinating thing like think about when you're a child and you have I guess this fantasy of19100:20:06,880 --> 00:20:12,960finding it's hidden door to a whole new secret world it's like this is existing this is the most19200:20:14,160 --> 00:20:19,600amazing scientific breakthrough the only thing that I could imagine equating that would be opening a door19300:20:19,600 --> 00:20:24,080and walking into a room and seeing colors I'd never seen before or finding out you can space travel19400:20:24,080 --> 00:20:30,640to a new galaxy with different species not even our solar system like a whole or galaxy a whole19500:20:30,640 --> 00:20:38,240new galaxy and just it had that level of fascination as well as you know realistic hope I could see19600:20:38,240 --> 00:20:44,000my dad and could continue living myself so that was what just propelled me and propelled me and I can19700:20:44,000 --> 00:20:49,680go more into what I learned and experience if you'd like yeah we definitely going to do that just19800:20:49,680 --> 00:20:56,000to clarify your dad passed away from medical complications yes yeah he had a stroke got you yep19900:20:56,000 --> 00:21:01,440when you mentioned someone traveling back in time and getting the medicine he needed to make himself20000:21:01,440 --> 00:21:06,480better I wanted to clarify that I assumed that the way that you researched whether there was life20100:21:06,480 --> 00:21:12,080after death was by reaching out to psychic mediums and things like that to see if you can make contact20200:21:12,080 --> 00:21:19,200were you able let's just jump to the spoiler were you able to make contact with your dad I'm pretty sure I did20300:21:19,200 --> 00:21:27,840yes and yeah after doing the research it took me reading multiple studies and books and up to20400:21:27,840 --> 00:21:35,600quintuple blinded studies on mediumship and taking some classes at the Ryan Education Center all this20500:21:35,600 --> 00:21:41,360logical science and reading it reading it before I was like maybe this might sound crazy but maybe I'll20600:21:41,360 --> 00:21:49,920go get a medium reading and go to some medium workshops and my very first reading she knew stuff she20700:21:49,920 --> 00:21:55,680could not have known and I hide my identity I wasn't like I am Elizabeth Edden here is my credit card20800:21:55,680 --> 00:22:02,160here's my email phone number like he's my birthday yes yes exactly I'm like you're in none of that20900:22:02,160 --> 00:22:10,800and she was amazing and I was like what the fuck like I just saw someone in front of my face to find21000:22:10,800 --> 00:22:16,880the laws of the universe it was like I had chills she brought in my dad my grandma my cat I was just like21100:22:16,880 --> 00:22:23,840wow amazed and I just remember leaving and turning to my mom who I made come out with me but21200:22:23,840 --> 00:22:29,360she went into a different room she went come in she thinks this is all crazy but I just turned to her and I was like21300:22:29,360 --> 00:22:36,320oh my god I think this is real and from there I was just so amazed I'm like I have to see this again so21400:22:36,320 --> 00:22:42,480I started getting other medium readings and it was across the board like I had quite a few where I21500:22:42,480 --> 00:22:48,480think they were very honest-hearted but not very accurate I had a couple that I was like hey are21600:22:48,480 --> 00:22:56,880completely full of shit and they knew it and I yeah and then I had more that I was just like they21700:22:56,880 --> 00:23:04,960could not have known this and it's just it's so profound it's just like yeah like getting or getting to21800:23:04,960 --> 00:23:12,800travel intergalactically getting to jump into another dimension of string theory it's just I21900:23:12,800 --> 00:23:18,560wasn't the words for how profound it was yeah no have you had any experience with the organization22000:23:18,560 --> 00:23:24,320that studies your death experiences oh yeah yeah I've read a lot of gone to some of their22100:23:25,040 --> 00:23:31,120zoom talks especially when we were all in quarantine I think really highly of them. Mm great so22200:23:31,120 --> 00:23:35,920because there's a there are a lot of scientifically minded people in that organization which is great then the22300:23:35,920 --> 00:23:41,840other people who are just full on in the woo and I find it I find it really interesting to see the dynamic22400:23:41,840 --> 00:23:47,920between that whole group winter in the same room together but how long did it take from the time22500:23:47,920 --> 00:23:52,400that your father passed when you started looking into this in earnest to the moment you got your psychic22600:23:52,400 --> 00:23:59,680medium reading that went for a change your whole world how long was that the research? Let's see I got my22700:23:59,680 --> 00:24:04,480first reading she said I had to wait till my dad I was like I didn't tell her it was my dad so my22800:24:04,480 --> 00:24:10,880person I had to wait until they had been gone at least six months that's what this specific woman said22900:24:10,880 --> 00:24:16,400and I was on another woman's waitlist who has a really long waitlist so I ended up going to her23000:24:16,400 --> 00:24:23,920workshops but I hadn't gotten a reading with her so this woman I guess let's see it was maybe about eight months23100:24:23,920 --> 00:24:29,680after my research after my research that I got my first reading okay yeah it's interesting six months23200:24:29,680 --> 00:24:33,760I hadn't heard that number I think I heard forty days it has to be as happens but I did here it's23300:24:33,760 --> 00:24:39,440consistent with you have to wait a certain amount of time because I guess the soul has to get acclimated or23400:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,880whatever it is different medium say different things I have come to think it's just a personal23500:24:45,600 --> 00:24:51,680choice of the mediums and each one I'm sure has their own reasons we're saying it but I've heard of23600:24:51,680 --> 00:25:00,640mediums have someone come in that day and you know maybe I mean I'm gonna I don't know I'd have to23700:25:00,640 --> 00:25:05,840respect and ask why each one says what they say but there isn't a consistency in that I have heard23800:25:05,840 --> 00:25:12,560some say they will say that because they just having someone that early in grief they don't feel23900:25:12,560 --> 00:25:17,520comfortable with they feel the person needs to process they feel could be dangerous for them psychologically24000:25:17,520 --> 00:25:24,400like they're not therapists they feel they don't want to take them on that early but each one so24100:25:24,400 --> 00:25:30,160some of them it's ethics some of them maybe the way their vibrations work they can't connect until24200:25:30,160 --> 00:25:34,320six months I don't specifically know for each of them but they all have different reasons24300:25:34,320 --> 00:25:40,080it's interesting to hear you talk because you are very pragmatic in a lot of different ways24400:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,720and you just talked about different vibrations that that people have that doesn't really fit into that24500:25:44,720 --> 00:25:50,880box so I'm fascinated in a time between 2015 that your debt passed and now it's almost 10 years24600:25:50,880 --> 00:25:58,320have you seen a progression of change in you as you go are you starting to lean more towards maybe24700:25:58,320 --> 00:26:05,440some more woo material or is it you very much sticking to this is scientific and there is nothing24800:26:05,440 --> 00:26:11,520that can do to my mind I guess you can say I'm leaning more towards what people could call24900:26:11,520 --> 00:26:20,160woo but with a non-woo up approach I think I guess I'll go to things have happened that would be25000:26:20,160 --> 00:26:27,040to find us woo but I think in the end everything science science is just explains the facts of how25100:26:27,040 --> 00:26:32,720things work so I think this happened there's a quote actually by Dr Ian Stevenson I'm not saying25200:26:32,720 --> 00:26:38,640it's true I'm just saying it happened so these things are happening and I will use I think when you get25300:26:38,640 --> 00:26:45,360into woo there's using somewhat of unrelatable words and an acceptance that of just belief and you're25400:26:45,360 --> 00:26:54,640not trying to get data so I will say this happened I don't know what to say about it but at this aspect25500:26:54,640 --> 00:27:00,000verified it this was just a weird thing that happened that wasn't verifiable I would like to try to25600:27:00,000 --> 00:27:07,280verify it more and putting it all together using factual language like an example just quickly let's say25700:27:07,280 --> 00:27:14,240you take an out of body experience and someone goes out and to me the word vibration isn't so woo25800:27:14,240 --> 00:27:21,440because it's literally a physical experience and even stringing you talk yeah so when I tried to25900:27:21,440 --> 00:27:27,200do out of body exercises I will feel waves and what is literally vibration so what would be used26000:27:27,200 --> 00:27:31,680to vibration if you took like you stood on like a vibrating plate you know which is what the gym26100:27:31,680 --> 00:27:38,400classes I go to and I'll feel them a few feet above my body I can't say I know why I'm doing that so if you26200:27:38,400 --> 00:27:44,880take a woo for lack of a better word approach you'd say I rose into the energetic field and I26300:27:44,880 --> 00:27:53,680felt like the angels around me and if you're to take a science-based approach I say I felt as if there26400:27:53,680 --> 00:28:00,640were waves of vibrations and if the nerves of my body instead of ending at my skin and did a few feet above26500:28:00,640 --> 00:28:05,920and that's just the facts I'm not adding more to it so what's the next step the next step is to try to get26600:28:05,920 --> 00:28:11,600better and see if I can go verify something if it really is out of body can I actually start to get26700:28:11,600 --> 00:28:19,200senses and physiological senses like eyesight and smell and some people have and they report back26800:28:19,200 --> 00:28:25,360then with facts that they were able to verify so that is the next step so I just try to report only the26900:28:25,360 --> 00:28:34,000facts and not draw conclusions beyond what I can get from actual facts. Makes perfect sense so I27000:28:34,000 --> 00:28:42,560got to ask the question have you yourself been able to leave your body? I don't know so I is that27100:28:42,560 --> 00:28:49,040we think my body when I feel sensations a few feet above maybe I've had dreams of going to places27200:28:49,440 --> 00:28:56,240that were then verified but what is that? Is that leaving my body? Is that remote viewing?27300:28:56,240 --> 00:29:01,360Which I guess I'll be out of body experiences. I'll be ease versus remote viewing could be described as27400:29:01,360 --> 00:29:08,880I come over to your place and I say oh you have that blue cup on your table versus work here on video27500:29:08,880 --> 00:29:14,960which would more be remote viewing. Oh I see that blue cup on your table. We don't know how it works.27600:29:16,720 --> 00:29:24,560I was I was I out of body was I getting was I remote viewing was I safely reading27700:29:24,560 --> 00:29:31,120somebody and then saw what they saw. I don't know but some people will say they've gone out of body and27800:29:31,120 --> 00:29:36,720I will believe them when they have been able to verify where they felt they were out of body they felt27900:29:36,720 --> 00:29:41,440sensations they visited somebody and they came or a place and came back with information about28000:29:41,440 --> 00:29:46,320that person or place and other people have even verified and said oh you know maybe they28100:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,720visit someone who is a medium and they'll say oh I saw you you were out of body at this time and something28200:29:50,720 --> 00:29:58,080corroborates. So then I've got to bring it back to something you said earlier it's fascinating to think about it28300:29:58,080 --> 00:30:03,360is it something that someone psychically or whatever ESP wise to let the28400:30:03,360 --> 00:30:10,880receive that information from you and then you spit out saying this that whatever could the psychic28500:30:10,880 --> 00:30:17,920medium instead of actual having contact with the dear dearly departed dad gotten the information from you28600:30:17,920 --> 00:30:24,400psychically and that's what you heard. That is one of the big questions. I actually Dr. Julie28700:30:24,400 --> 00:30:29,600Baishill I have a few responses to this first of all there's actual studies done by Windbridge to test28800:30:29,600 --> 00:30:39,360for just that and they for example one of the ways they do highly blinded readings where the28900:30:39,360 --> 00:30:44,880sitter goes and takes down all the information the sitter's the one who the medium's giving the information to29000:30:44,880 --> 00:30:53,120and the sitter doesn't actually know I guess they're called a proxy sitter they actually don't know29100:30:53,120 --> 00:30:59,280who the reading is for it's one of the experimenters out of I don't know what pool or volunteer29200:30:59,280 --> 00:31:08,400experimenters and so how could the medium be reading the mind of that sitter so then I mean29300:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,840it you can look at when bridge for all the details but essentially the person they're giving the information29400:31:11,840 --> 00:31:18,480too does not know. Then there's another part where mediums have given me information I thought was wrong29500:31:18,480 --> 00:31:24,720and said no and clarified with somebody else one of my breathes was a medium this was early in29600:31:24,720 --> 00:31:29,760our friendships as she didn't know much about me my uncle had recently passed I purposely did not tell her that29700:31:29,760 --> 00:31:37,520and she I'd always thought he was over six feet he was under six feet and really angry about it29800:31:37,520 --> 00:31:41,440but I was never told that I didn't even know because I guess he was really angry and he was young and my29900:31:41,440 --> 00:31:45,680parents were older parents so like by the time he was older middle age when I was born he wasn't talking30000:31:45,680 --> 00:31:52,240about it anymore but she kept saying he's just under six feet I kept saying no and it was true and that's30100:31:52,240 --> 00:31:58,320not the only bit of information and this has come up repeatedly and research now another part of this is30200:31:58,320 --> 00:32:03,840mediums I've got to trust them at this point once who've passed scientific studies once I know I30300:32:03,840 --> 00:32:09,680mean I wouldn't go on this alone but they say it feels completely different little describe it in different ways30400:32:09,680 --> 00:32:14,960and now there's one medium who even says she see psychic information one she likes these a screen30500:32:14,960 --> 00:32:19,360and see psychic information on the left and medium ship on the right I might have reversed it but30600:32:19,360 --> 00:32:26,560she's also studied highly by scientists she's had a brain scan and the brain activity in psychic30700:32:26,560 --> 00:32:33,360versus medium shows up differently fascinating that's amazing quick question I do want to talk to you30800:32:33,360 --> 00:32:38,080about the book in the podcast but before we do that a question jumps into my mind because you had a30900:32:38,080 --> 00:32:42,880lot of experience with psychic mediums I know there's an organization out there that certifies mediums31000:32:42,880 --> 00:32:48,400we had him on the show that talk about his organization and he found it which I think is fantastic31100:32:48,400 --> 00:32:53,680and they actually have a website where here the mediums that are actually certified as and he31200:32:53,680 --> 00:33:01,760has to be 100% they can't have a single thing in correct that's not true actually yeah so I'm very31300:33:01,760 --> 00:33:07,360bald of forever family foundation bob and his life friend gets broke were my absent mentors is31400:33:07,360 --> 00:33:12,960in friend was just the one the hardest things so you knew you knew fanon I knew her very well31500:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,920she was like oh that's amazing because when we met bob he she had already passed31600:33:16,960 --> 00:33:23,920yeah yeah yeah Fran is like I feel yeah she was probably one of the most important people in my life31700:33:23,920 --> 00:33:29,520the past few years so yeah sign up for him very very well and I was only the person they have to be31800:33:29,520 --> 00:33:35,120100% accurate that's not that's not the case that is not the case no medium is 100% accurate they have to31900:33:35,120 --> 00:33:42,240be significantly accurate beyond the odds of chance so for example let's say I'll take a random person32000:33:42,240 --> 00:33:51,920let's say they lost their grandmother Sarah who so medium might sit there and say an S name like32100:33:51,920 --> 00:34:00,800Sarah Sarah I'm getting a grandmother energy on your mother's side she died at 70 she was a32200:34:00,800 --> 00:34:09,920high school teacher had two children and she rode horses and that's really significant let's say she32300:34:09,920 --> 00:34:16,320was not a high school teacher and that was wrong let's say she did not ride horses but the rest is really32400:34:16,320 --> 00:34:23,600impressive so that would still be a medium who passed okay and well then I apologize to all those32500:34:23,600 --> 00:34:29,200taking me to what called a fraud in my mind when they were wrong with one thing sorry about that right32600:34:29,200 --> 00:34:34,800but if they're getting most wrong or if mediums are getting everything right but it's general like32700:34:34,800 --> 00:34:38,880you have a 30 year old sitting in front of you and you're like you've had a lot of loss like you32800:34:38,880 --> 00:34:45,360don't have any living great grandparents am I right and you know I see that your great grandmother they32900:34:45,360 --> 00:34:50,000sort of were in like that traditional role and your great grandfather was too like the male female33000:34:50,000 --> 00:34:56,240they had a lot of children like there's things that just can be very general generation based and some33100:34:56,240 --> 00:35:03,760of those mediums might be frauds they might be really genuine herded and just get very general information33200:35:03,760 --> 00:35:09,360and maybe just having pushed themselves to be evidential because maybe their clients have acquired it or maybe33300:35:09,360 --> 00:35:15,120they're just things are popping like I've taken mediumship classes and I have sat with people and33400:35:15,120 --> 00:35:20,400given them readings and information is coming into my head that's really logical because I'm doing33500:35:20,400 --> 00:35:25,760the assignment I'm told to say what comes into my head and I know it's coming logically and I'm trying33600:35:25,760 --> 00:35:33,840to be right to do the assignments because I'm there but and the person depending who some are either maybe33700:35:33,840 --> 00:35:37,440they're very believey or and in the class with them and they're trying to be respectful and they're like33800:35:37,440 --> 00:35:42,480no you're good you're getting everything right I'm like right but of course I am there's just certain33900:35:42,480 --> 00:35:48,800things and you person can to do it right sure so so so then do you think that the only way to make34000:35:48,800 --> 00:35:53,840sure you don't get swindled by a psychic medium who's just foolish is to just not give them any34100:35:53,840 --> 00:35:58,000information at all to be a complete blank slate or there are other ways you can make sure that that doesn't34200:35:58,000 --> 00:36:04,960happen to you. I think the this is a fine line and the beginning I was just like give nothing I think34300:36:04,960 --> 00:36:14,400I think it's a fine line I think take protocols give you know hide your identity as much as you can34400:36:14,400 --> 00:36:20,480and when you're sitting there I mean you have to let them lead a little bit but you can34500:36:20,480 --> 00:36:27,760afterwards be like oh that was you're like bullshit but I think if they come in and the first thing they say34600:36:27,760 --> 00:36:34,240is yeah it really because it is a fine line because I did it too much of like not say anything in the34700:36:34,240 --> 00:36:41,040beginning and scientific studies like again if you read like the research studies like Dr. Julie34800:36:41,040 --> 00:36:48,800by actually literally give nothing but you know when you're getting a reading it's a fine line you know34900:36:49,360 --> 00:36:54,800don't give them more than they ask for if they're like I'm getting like a tea named a book oh my god35000:36:54,800 --> 00:37:01,280that's my brother I can't believe he's here and he I miss him so much we were twins don't do that say yes35100:37:01,280 --> 00:37:07,840and then if they ask for a little more if they're like I'm just not getting like he and getting he's35200:37:07,840 --> 00:37:13,920your generation but not more than that then you can say okay he was my twin or if you're35300:37:13,920 --> 00:37:22,880understanding something and they're not and you can tell like let's say I don't know like you35400:37:22,880 --> 00:37:31,360look okay so I'm giving a little my own evidence here but you know okay like like I got a few35500:37:31,360 --> 00:37:37,520readings in the beginning where they're like was your dad either hurt enough fire or was he a fireman35600:37:37,520 --> 00:37:43,680who's the fireman why am I hearing fire fire island was really important in our family as a child35700:37:43,680 --> 00:37:49,520so maybe they're seeing a fire because you are working with humans so my dad would be like fire35800:37:49,520 --> 00:37:55,280dollar fire island fire so they're just seeing fire because fire island isn't any place they've35900:37:55,280 --> 00:38:01,840ever heard of or been let's say so they're saying so he's giving them because it's not like it's not as36000:38:01,840 --> 00:38:06,080good as speaking on the phone it's just not if it was we wouldn't be questioning and studying if36100:38:06,080 --> 00:38:15,920there's an afterlife we would know if you've just sit there and are so literal that you say no then you're36200:38:15,920 --> 00:38:20,240not going to get more but if you say in that situation I would say yeah there's something that36300:38:20,240 --> 00:38:24,400would be like not exactly but fire makes sense can you give me a little more and if they're like oh36400:38:24,400 --> 00:38:30,400I can't you know can you give me some more then you can yeah and I'd say fire island is where I36500:38:30,400 --> 00:38:34,400went the summers and maybe suddenly they're like oh my god yes that's it that feels right36600:38:34,400 --> 00:38:39,760and I believe they say that feels right because they're certified by rubber family or wind bridge36700:38:39,760 --> 00:38:44,720and they got quite a bit of information like they got the letter of my dad they don't always36800:38:44,720 --> 00:38:50,320get the name sometimes they do they got like aspects of his personality and hobbies and work so I'm like36900:38:50,320 --> 00:38:57,040okay I already trust them and so then if I say yes it was fire island my readings can be that much better37000:38:57,040 --> 00:39:00,480because that's all that makes so much sense let's see if we can go further with that and maybe they37100:39:00,480 --> 00:39:06,560got a specific memory from that I think if if you're not doing what I'm doing where it's really about37200:39:06,560 --> 00:39:12,240research and you go to a medium and they're not getting that information and they're trying to37300:39:12,240 --> 00:39:18,320ask you a lot of questions because I've experienced this and it's clear they're fishing I will start37400:39:18,320 --> 00:39:24,320to let them lead and go along with it because it helps by research if I really just wanted this reading37500:39:24,320 --> 00:39:29,840for itself and I wasn't getting readings regularly and exploring you have a right to say37600:39:30,800 --> 00:39:36,800don't wait like 40 minutes in but after like five or 10 minutes if everything you're saying is no37700:39:36,800 --> 00:39:43,840an ethical medium will say and this has happened to me I'm so sorry I'm not getting the information37800:39:43,840 --> 00:39:50,960that you need I'm not connecting we can end this now and I'll refund you or you can come back in like37900:39:50,960 --> 00:39:57,760a month and we'll see if it's better so it's all a balance I think the way to prevent getting38000:39:57,760 --> 00:40:03,280slindled don't give your information upfront don't make it Googleable then once you're there it's really38100:40:03,280 --> 00:40:10,720it's refined and just don't pour out just try to say yes no or maybe until there's a reason to say anything38200:40:10,720 --> 00:40:15,680more than that and then the other this is just one of the things I mean some people might just be like38300:40:15,680 --> 00:40:22,000well obviously but nevertheless people when you're in grief or trauma it brings some work the same38400:40:22,000 --> 00:40:28,080way so there is it is absolutely not on you if this has happened to you in any way but some mediums which38500:40:28,080 --> 00:40:34,880had happened to me told me had like bad energy around me and she sold $300 candles that would cure38600:40:34,880 --> 00:40:42,800it anyone tries to sell do not do not do not do not that doesn't mean if you're like oh you know I would38700:40:42,800 --> 00:40:47,200love to try to say could reading again then or another reading or something yeah you're going to have to38800:40:47,200 --> 00:40:53,280pay for another service but they don't try to sell up any up sell you have a curse on your family and38900:40:53,280 --> 00:41:00,640I can lift it for $500 yeah exactly exactly so do want to talk to you about your book and your podcast39000:41:00,640 --> 00:41:06,800WTF just happened yes was the book first or was the podcast first which came first check it39100:41:06,800 --> 00:41:14,320of the egg book came way first the podcast yes the podcast was one of those I'm lonely and39200:41:14,320 --> 00:41:18,560I'm alone in my room and I saw I did a work quarantine I want to talk to work people let me just try39300:41:18,560 --> 00:41:24,400a podcast it'll be fun and then it was so much more fun and I expected it and I taught myself like39400:41:24,400 --> 00:41:30,000I said it and it was just ended up being an addition but now something I definitely want to stick with39500:41:30,000 --> 00:41:34,880we talked of all this time about after life and second mediums is that what you show when you're39600:41:34,880 --> 00:41:42,320book is about or is it does it dive a little bit more into other things so my book it's another one39700:41:42,320 --> 00:41:50,480is going to be coming out at some point and it soon is so my book which I'll explain why I said that so my39800:41:50,480 --> 00:42:01,600book starts with from when my father first got really sick to about maybe like two to three years39900:42:01,600 --> 00:42:06,400after and all the research I had done in my experiences that it talks some it doesn't start with40000:42:06,400 --> 00:42:12,480mediums it starts with research and the doctor's of talk and it starts with how I'm like oh my god what40100:42:12,480 --> 00:42:18,240the fact like they're actually seems to be some evidence but there has to be a catch and it starts with40200:42:18,240 --> 00:42:24,880how I keep going further and further with this and then start meeting the people and then so much40300:42:24,880 --> 00:42:30,080has happened since the book ended so much like I've gotten this is just when I first start meeting40400:42:30,080 --> 00:42:34,480the people and I've gotten to know them really well and have participated with them in experiments40500:42:34,480 --> 00:42:39,360and done so much more and that's what I'm going to go into next so this is just the whole journey what the40600:42:39,360 --> 00:42:44,240book just happened of how I went from thinking there was zero chance of it after life to all these40700:42:44,240 --> 00:42:50,720very logical reasons to why I completely changed my mind it's actually like light and funny and40800:42:50,720 --> 00:42:56,800talks about like all the awkward things that happened along the way like yeah just yes I'm sure40900:42:56,800 --> 00:43:01,600like met the mediums and tried to like see if they were cheating and like when who's one of my best friends41000:43:01,600 --> 00:43:07,840now like thought I was like a journalist trying to expose him and just really silly things happened along41100:43:07,840 --> 00:43:12,800so I and friends with big part of the book too so that was in the book then so then you do41200:43:12,800 --> 00:43:16,240suggest you read the book first and then listen to the podcast or can you jump into the podcast41300:43:16,240 --> 00:43:22,000without having had to read the book you can jump into the podcast so the podcast is a variety it's41400:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,200psychic mediums I have like it's paris psychologists like Lloyd Arbock it's a few people who've had41500:43:27,200 --> 00:43:36,560personal experiences who verify it it's near death researchers it's um I have someone who's an animal41600:43:36,560 --> 00:43:43,760communicator yeah so just it's across the board I even have as someone that person hasn't come out yet41700:43:43,760 --> 00:43:48,160but I'm going to have ones on out of body I'm going to have ones on remote viewing and I'm going to have41800:43:48,160 --> 00:43:52,480a skeptic who's like a professional skeptic who doesn't think any of this is true and we just41900:43:52,480 --> 00:43:56,240get into a really interesting conversation and that's actually one of my favorite episodes not42000:43:56,240 --> 00:44:03,200ready yet but it's just really interesting sounds fascinating I can't believe that the time is flown so42100:44:03,200 --> 00:44:08,800fast if someone wanted to listen to your show or reach out to you we're going to add for sure those42200:44:08,800 --> 00:44:13,760links in our show notes but what's the best way for someone to reach you if they are so inclined42300:44:13,760 --> 00:44:21,760you can go to my website which is wTFjusthappened.net because that links to everything you can link to my email42400:44:21,760 --> 00:44:28,000you can link to amazon we can buy my book you can link to all the places that you can listen to my podcast42500:44:28,000 --> 00:44:35,200or on all the all the usual places you can find me on my social media like Instagram and TikTok a lot of42600:44:35,200 --> 00:44:40,000people reach out to me Instagram you can email me and all that's right on my website for you to find.42700:44:40,000 --> 00:44:44,160Perfect that's awesome this has been so much fun we're definitely going to add those links42800:44:44,160 --> 00:44:48,160I'm going to connect with you offline because any friend of Bob's a friend of mine for sure.42900:44:48,160 --> 00:44:54,960Thank you so much. Now we have a lot more skip the minutes of this and coming up so stay with us we'll be right back.43000:44:54,960 --> 00:45:15,680We got what might be our new favorite review this one is from john masina and he gave us a43100:45:15,680 --> 00:45:22,000five star review and titled it great show for those both new and old to metaphysics. He goes on to say43200:45:22,000 --> 00:45:28,080I'm a UPS driver for work so I've got a lot of podcast listening time because of this I've listened to43300:45:28,080 --> 00:45:34,400almost every episode of the show amazing I've believed in many of not all of the modalities spoken about43400:45:34,400 --> 00:45:40,240on this podcast for as long as I can remember I felt weird for just having a knowing about certain things43500:45:40,240 --> 00:45:46,000and because of my knowing I always understood that the world around me wasn't ready to talk about this stuff yet43600:45:46,000 --> 00:45:53,040so I kept it to myself forever the chameleon. I still explored it well into my 20s diving into all43700:45:53,040 --> 00:45:58,080sorts of mind expanding situations and discussions with the few I knew would hear and understand me.43800:45:58,080 --> 00:46:03,440Then I got a big boy job and that part of me stayed on the back burner for a few years.43900:46:03,440 --> 00:46:08,080A few months back I was craving something that could connect to in all levels44000:46:08,640 --> 00:46:14,880enter the skeptic metaphysicians after a brief google search for best podcast that discussed metaphysics44100:46:14,880 --> 00:46:21,440I found this podcast at the top of the list so naturally I dove in. Fast forward about four months44200:46:21,440 --> 00:46:27,680and I only have a couple of episodes left. My only complaint is that there isn't a few hundred more44300:46:27,680 --> 00:46:33,920episodes but I guess I should have piece myself better so that's on me. You guys are great thank you for44400:46:33,920 --> 00:46:41,600all the work you do and making me feel normal and folks that's the most important part of this review.44500:46:41,600 --> 00:46:48,720This last sentence says thank you for making me feel normal and that's a very powerful statement44600:46:48,720 --> 00:46:55,360because a lot of us are feeling this seismic shift that is happening in our world right now44700:46:55,360 --> 00:47:01,840and a lot of us are feeling weird and off and this stuff if it speaks to us if it resonates with us44800:47:01,840 --> 00:47:08,080sometimes it makes us feel like we are not right like we're not normal and the fact that we're diving44900:47:08,080 --> 00:47:13,600into these things we're showcasing we're showing that these things these fields are coming in45000:47:13,600 --> 00:47:21,840inside of you they're normal we're all real normal people going through an awakening on mass45100:47:21,840 --> 00:47:30,400so if you've ever felt abnormal then take it from John this is a show for you because we are normalizing45200:47:30,400 --> 00:47:38,320these conversations John thank you thank you so much for sending us this review and for being such an45300:47:38,320 --> 00:47:44,160habit listener of our show we can't do it without you and we really appreciate you if you would like45400:47:44,160 --> 00:47:50,000to hear your review read on the air just go to skepticmanifusitions.com you can either leave us a review45500:47:50,000 --> 00:47:56,800there written or go to apple podcasts and leave us a review written there or if you prefer to45600:47:56,800 --> 00:48:03,040speak your mind you can always go to skepticmanifusition.com hit the leave us a voicemail tab and record45700:48:03,040 --> 00:48:09,120us a voicemail that we will possibly air on the show thanks again John and thank you for listening to the show45800:48:09,120 --> 00:48:17,600thanks for coming along on this journey discovery with us we'd love to continue our conversation45900:48:17,600 --> 00:48:23,920with you on our website at skepticmanifusition.com or on Facebook and Instagram under skeptic46000:48:28,800 --> 00:48:35,840show do them and us a favor and share the show with them it will help get the word out about us and46100:48:35,840 --> 00:48:40,560it may just change someone's life for the better and if you're listening to this on the radio you46200:48:40,560 --> 00:48:47,360missed something well not to worry all of our shows including this one can be found at skepticmanifusition.com46300:48:47,360 --> 00:48:53,680we can also watch the videos we even send us an email or voicemail directly from the site we absolutely46400:48:54,320 --> 00:48:59,440love feedback and would appreciate hearing from you I hope you've enjoyed this episode46500:48:59,440 --> 00:49:04,000much as we have that all for now we'll see you on the next episode of the skeptic46600:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,480metaphysicians. Until then take care46700:49:06,480 --> 00:49:16,480[Music]